The Bechdel Rule

[arisha]

So through the Twilight post on Feministing I was introduced to the "Bechdel Rule," which requires that a movie must A) have two female characters B) who have a conversation C) about something that is not a man. I was reminded of this rule while A and I were watching Iron Man tonight - a movie that almost fulfills this rule, but makes me think there should be a fourth component to it, perhaps: D) without one of the characters insulting the other. (Man, Iron Man was a textbook case of how Hollywood treats fictional women, am I right or am I right. :/ )

Guys, this makes me want to start a meme! To participate, please go through your favourite movies and tell me which ones do and do not fulfill this rule. :D

My list, with the note that I am only counting female characters who are important enough that you would list them if you were making a list of characters in the movie:

After Life: Actually a pretty good number of female characters (Shiori, the woman who remembers her brother, the woman who collects flower petals, the girl who remembers her mother, the woman who lies about her age, Kyoko, the woman who remembers the earthquake, the woman who remembers meeting her boyfriend after the war, the secretary). Shiori and the girl who remembers her mother have two conversations (one about Disneyland and one about their parents), and the woman who remembers the earthquake shows Shiori how to make onigiri, so this one definitely passes.

Aladdin: ONE female character (Jasmine). COMPLETE AND UTTER FAIL!

Amadeus: Four female characters (Stanzi, Frau Weber, Katerina, Lorl). The closest thing to a conversation that any of them has with another is when Stanzi asks Lorl if the anonymous person is going to be paying her. So that's a pass, but kind of a pathetic one ...

Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Black Pearl: Five female characters, but I'm being a bit lenient here (Elizabeth, her servant lady, Annamaria, Scarlett, Giselle). Elizabeth and Annamaria shout at each other about how best to outrun the pirates, so technically it passes, but Annamaria is pretty eager to offer Elizabeth to the pirates which I think kind of breaks my addition to the rule.

Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man's Chest: Four female characters (Elizabeth, Tia Dalma, Scarlett, Giselle). I'm calling this a fail; Scarlett and Giselle exchange knowing glances but they're thinking about Jack, and when Tia Dalma talks to Elizabeth everyone is thinking about Jack, so yeah. That's a fail.

Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End: Seven female characters (Elizabeth, Tia Dalma, Mistress Ching, Scarlett, Giselle, Sao Feng's two women who have three minutes of screen time). Elizabeth talks to Tia Dalma but about Sao Feng. Mistress Ching asks Elizabeth for her orders? So I guess this passes, although like Amadeus, it's kind of pathetic ...

I feel like I'm forgetting a really obvious movie, but oh well that's enough for now. x) How do your favourite movies stand up??

Comments

[leaf-green.livejournal.com]

I think it sort of fits that Amadeus fails. Music was not about women, heck, only churning out babies and food was what women were 'good for' back then. They had a special kind of invisible. So, does a movie trying to be faithful to its period excuse it?

[arisha.livejournal.com]

I would say that a movie's time period doesn't excuse it, because I imagine that all throughout history women have been able to converse with each other about a variety of things. A movie's subject matter, though? Maybe. Like if you were making a movie exclusively about a group of soldiers in a war where no women were soldiers, then fine. I don't remember whether or not you've seen Amadeus, but while I see your point, I don't think the movie really follows the idea of women being invisible. Stanzi especially has some pretty important scenes in the director's cut that have nothing to do with churning out babies and food! xD I'm actually really surprised there's only one actual conversation between women in the movie, because there are a ton of scenes where there's a group of women together, they're just never talking I guess ...

[anniekate76.livejournal.com]

I just recently saw the stage play, and the women in it had a pretty non-baby-food-role in that they were singers and students. But they were subjugated a lot, by their skirts being chased and so forth.

I am a huge fan of Alison Bechdel and so the Bechdel rule is not at all new to me. But I had never considered before whether my favorite movie, Groundhog Day, passes it! Possibly because it does not, and I didn't want to face the truth. That movie is all about Bill Murray's character. In its defense, for him to progress he has to learn that one mustn't try to learn about a woman's interests solely to get into her pants, but because you can't actually love a person until you see them as a human being.

Movies I've seen recently vs. Bechdel ...

[the-wykydtron.livejournal.com]

Lord of the Rings trilogy: Fail. In a book with dozens of characters, only three are women. Galadriel, Eowyn and Arwen never get the chance to interact with each other. Plus two of them are in love with the same dude. OH WAIT I FORGOT SHELOB. Well, she doesn't have a speaking role.

Hellboy 2: I don't think Nuada and Liz ever talk to each other, actually, for all of their awesomeness ... unless one of them tells the other to duck or jump or something during an action sequence.

The Dark Knight: The two main female characters, Rachel and Detective Ramirez, never meet, and Rachel gets offed halfway through anyways. Which actually made me really angry, because it made me realize that the movie just used her as a point of conflict for the two men who loved her, and didn't care about her character that much. Sob. Ramirez's only interaction with the other female character, Gordon's wife, is ostensibly about Gordon's family's safety (which is only important because they're *Gordon's* family) but then turns out to be a trick to get Gordon vulnerable, so technically their conversation is about a man.

Death Note 2: AH HAH HAH HAH HAH! Misa-Misa: "I LOVE LIGHT! LIGHT IS THE ONLY PERSON IN THE WORLD WHO MATTERS TO ME! I will kill myself for Light!" So Misa ... not so much. Light's mom and sister only ever talk about Light or their father. The reporter has conversations with her female boss and her female friend, but both of them revolve around sexuality in the workplace, and given the context of these conversations I'd argue that they're obliquely about men (especially the sexual harassment one, lol). But Light's sister does have an exchange about celebrities with her friend ... does that count? "It would be cool if there were a celebrity here!"

The Last Unicorn: WIN! The unicorn and Molly talk about the unicorn. In fact, only about half of what they say to each other is about Lir or Schmendrick - I think they have a pretty cool relationship, actually.

Much Ado About Nothing: This is total fail, but because it's a matchmaking plot, I think it's a little unfair to hold it up to the Bechdel rule. The whole THING is about talking about the opposite sex. But there are subplots involving male characters, and those guys get to have wacky discussions about upholding the law and upholding their honour and how much Keanu Reeves hates his brother for a reason that doesn't circulate around a woman. For the women ... not so much. They're stuck in the main plot, and get to have no other intrigues.

Lawrence of Arabia: EPIC PHAIL. There are no female characters.

God, any movie that has an all-female cast is immediately a chick flick, but an all-male cast is just a regular movie.